Commons talk:Chris's Acorns

Depicted copyrighted works

List

 Info Just put in the file name (incl. "File:") in the log to see the upload log entry which usually contains the source URL - in case you want to view. --Saibo (Δ) 02:21, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Should we consider using a template like {{Red link with log}} in the list (seems to need filename underscores in parameter)?

• e.g. File:Acorn Music500 User.jpg (Log) -- Trevj (talk) 09:49, 18 January 2012 (UTC)

I was not aware of {{Red link with log}}, using it would be best.Smallman12q (talk) 02:40, 19 January 2012 (UTC)

Now used under #Clear DW below. -- Trevj (talk) 10:14, 20 January 2012 (UTC)

Clear DW

1. File:Acorn Music500 User.jpg (Log)
2. File:Acorn PhotoQV box (front).jpg (Log)
3. File:VTI Printer Port Sampler box.jpg (Log)

Maybe DM or easily retouchable

1. File:Nidd Valley Digimouse box.jpg The mouse is what this photo is about → not DM. The mouse drawing greatly contributes to the image. Without the photo is not really useful. Or would the left part be? --Saibo (Δ) 01:40, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

   The left part could arguably be cropped to retain just the simple logo (geometric shapes). However, this would be additional work and we may not have the resources to do this for all such images within a reasonable period of time. -- Trevj (talk) 09:14, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

    Done--Saibo (Δ) 01:55, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

2. File:Acorn Music500 box (rather tatty).jpg Same again. The image is useless without the box's artwork. We could keep the front part with the text logo.--Saibo (Δ) 01:40, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

   Ditto regarding simple logo. -- Trevj (talk) 09:14, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

    Done--Saibo (Δ) 01:55, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

3. File:Advantage Six A9home with keyboard and monitor.jpg - I wonder a bit. You apparently have looked at it but don't see the screen's content as a problem? ;-) Even the description refers to the screen's content. That is then not DM but DW. Agree or deletion request? Oh, and, that may be retouchable (blank/blur screen) if the image is worth it. I would do it. Cheers --Saibo (Δ) 03:08, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

   I wasn't sure whether or not to upload. I figured that since there's a flash in the center, that may alter it enough. You're the common's admin, so you I'll follow you're expertise. There's really no need for the image (it doesn't add much as its low-res), so you can darken it out if you wish. Also, I'll leave the tables in html3 as its extra work to convert it to wiki table, and they'll both render the same. I don't expect the tables to be edited in the future. I've left out a number of non-free images, I'll post a list at the end.Smallman12q (talk) 17:17, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

   That is the reason for avoiding html - with html it is more probable that no one will edit. ;-) However, of course, if you already got the table in HTML (not written new) then it is fine. OK, will darken the screen soon (and will quickly ask someone else for his opinion - but I am quite sure that this is not DM). Cheers --Saibo (Δ) 01:45, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

The following are photos of systems running, so they include a screenshot. Should they be blanked/deleted?Smallman12q (talk) 20:42, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

1. File:Matrix NC running NCOS 1.11.jpg
2. File:Embedded RISC OS 4.06 start up messages.jpg
   • {{PD-text}}? -- Trevj (talk) 08:28, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
3. File:RiscStation NetWORX HD computer running RISC OS 4.03.jpg
4. File:RiscStation R7500 desktop running RISC OS 4 Select 3.jpg
5. File:Pace DSL4000 Versions sceen.jpg
   • Mainly text, with DM (or {{PD-textlogo}}) Pace logo on screen? -- Trevj (talk) 08:28, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
6. File:Pace DSL4000 RISC OS * prompt.jpg
   • {{PD-text}}? -- Trevj (talk) 08:28, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
7. File:Pace DSL4000.jpg
8. File:NetProducts NetStation initial screen.jpg
9. File:MicroDigital Mico running RISC OS 4.03.jpg
10. File:Castle A7000+ Odyssey.jpg
11. File:IBX200 running a RISC OS desktop.jpg
12. File:IBX100 RISC OS desktop.jpg
13. file:IBX100 configuration screen.jpg

Skipped

Non-free

• image source

low-res

These are skipped because they have hi-res counterparts

• image source
  • You have not uploaded this? Hmm.. Think this could be okay. --Saibo (Δ) 03:34, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

    There's the hi-res version at File:Castle Risc PC PS2 Keyboard (HiRes).jpg. 10:34, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

• image
• image, image in source

after acorn

non-free from after acorn

1. Chris's Acorns: Bush Internet Surf Set Direct
2. Chris's Acorns: Bush Internet Surf Set Direct
3. Chris's Acorns: Bush Internet Surf Set Direct
4. Chris's Acorns: Bush Internet Surf Set Direct
5. Chris's Acorns: Bush Internet Surf Set Direct
6. Chris's Acorns: Bush Internet Surf Set Direct
7. Chris's Acorns: Castle Iyonix Direct
8. Chris's Acorns: Cerilica Nucleus Direct
9. Chris's Acorns: Cerilica Nucleus Direct
10. Chris's Acorns: Element 14 AcTiVe Set Top Box Direct
11. Chris's Acorns: Element 14 AcTiVe Set Top Box Direct
12. Chris's Acorns: IMS/Interconnex Peanut Direct
13. Chris's Acorns: IMS/Interconnex Peanut Direct
14. Chris's Acorns: IMS/Interconnex Peanut Direct
15. Chris's Acorns: Millipede Imago Direct
16. Chris's Acorns: Net Products Direct
17. Chris's Acorns: Net Products Direct
18. Chris's Acorns: Pace DSL4000 Direct
19. Chris's Acorns: RiscStation Direct
20. Chris's Acorns: Simtec Electronics Direct
21. Chris's Acorns: Simtec Electronics Direct
22. Chris's Acorns: Simtec Electronics Direct
23. Chris's Acorns: Simtec Electronics Direct

low-res

A few low-res are missing...will have to check which later (overwrote low-res log=( ).

Discussion

Hi guys, a question: what's about the works by other people? Do you have free licenses also from Acorn? Or From AMX (some other photos)? If not we cannot keep those photos per COM:DW (unless the works are DM which they aren't here as they are the main subject). Cheers --Saibo (Δ) 22:49, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the note. It looks like a couple have slipped through. The bot filing intends to skip non-free images, which should be easy enough to exclude. Do we mark these for deletion now or put them in a non-free category for bulk deletion when the job's finished? Thanks. -- Trevj (talk) 08:37, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

I now see there is a relatively small number of other covers which are also currently present here. Some would IMO qualify for COM:DM inclusion, but certainly not all of them. -- Trevj (talk) 13:18, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

As those are "accidental" uploads (+copyvio) I can just speedy them per your request. Do you have a list of them? For the cases which you think they could be DM: we should discuss them indiviudally (unless there are some very similar images) in Deletion Requests. Cheers --Saibo (Δ) 14:13, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

If I do upload non-free images, they should be deleted as soon as they are recognized as such, though there should be a central log of these deletion . I was initially told by Chris that all the non-free images have been filtered out, but it seems some have slipped through. I'll be more careful to not upload cover art. Are images like File:Nidd Valley Digimouse box.jpg or File:Acorn_Music500_box_(rather_tatty).jpg okay? (Also, trevj should inform chris that not all the non-free images have been seperated.)Smallman12q (talk) 01:17, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

Hi Smallman12, what do you mean by central log? Do you want me to make a list? Can do. I also could do a list of which I regard as discussable. I would go through all uploaded files then.. some day in the near future. ;-)
@ the files see my comments above. Cheers --Saibo (Δ) 01:40, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

If a list is made, it would be most helpful to editors IMO if the source URLs could also be retained. This would give editors direct access to box art which could be incorporated as non-free content (justified through article use) in individual language Wikipedias. Would it also be possible for deleted files to be retained in a category, eg. Category:Non-free images deleted from Chris's Acorns? Thanks. -- Trevj (talk) 09:14, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

No, deleted pages can not be categorized. You would need to create a empty page with just a category... but that is not used at Commons. I will do this list like above. I will not mention the source URLs as I do not want to support non-free content. :-) And, ehm, you should not have uploaded all those photos - so please do not complicate their deletion with some non-free wishes. Cheers --Saibo (Δ) 01:46, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

A simple list will suffice. You can determine where the images are from based on filename, so no need for link. Thanks for being reasonable!Smallman12q (talk) 03:02, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

What do you mean by simple list? Containing what? --Saibo (Δ) 03:33, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

A list of filenames is fine as you're doing under Commons_talk:Chris's_Acorns#List. I've looked at Category:Acorn Computers 32-bit upgrades and expansions and see that Category:Network Test and Category:Documentation should be renamed to something more specific...otherwise the category looks fine. I added ~100 categories and a few hundred files...will do more later today. Smallman12q (talk) 15:03, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

Upload progress

-I've finished Category:Acorn Computers 32-bit upgrades and expansions. There are 3 more "directories" to go: afteracorn, computers, and Network having hundreds more images. A few images were missed in [1] and [2] due to a space in the file naming. So far there are ~1.6k images are up, though few are used (hopefully this will improve =D ).Smallman12q (talk) 21:07, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. You're right that the number of images used will certainly increase. Including within existing articles will be a start. Once notability can be estiablished for individual items, they can be included in new articles, which will mean >1 photo can be included without giving undue weight within a main article. We're still recruiting more editors interested in this area, so this will be a slow process for the moment. -- Trevj (talk) 09:49, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

That's fine, as long as they're categorized and exist on the commons, eventually they'll be used, and at worst, they'll be found. Commons images rank well on google=D. I'll do some uploading this weekend, have to add some code so that the specification table will be uploaded with each image.Smallman12q (talk) 02:07, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

I've finished Category:Products after Acorn. There are a number of non-free images, and also several with computer monitors that may have non-free images. Please remove as you see fit. I'll wait before doing computers to know what should/shouldn't be uploaded.Smallman12q (talk) 20:44, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Nice one. Will the hi-res http://acorn.chriswhy.co.uk/Pics/IyonixDL.html also be included (linked from Castle Iyonix)? (Current photos included at w:en:Iyonix PC.) -- Trevj (talk) 09:51, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

The hi-res are in a subfolder in the "pics" folder, and will be uploaded as the batch progresses. I've asked Geoffbrigham to see whether images that have screenshots should be uploaded. I'll refrain from further uploading until its clarified (hopefully soon).Smallman12q (talk) 23:14, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

Geoff has stated that a reply will be given in the future (I'm hoping before March) so will have to wait. Smallman12q (talk) 01:50, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

OK. I'm planning some work on w:en:Acorn Archimedes in the next month or two and hope to find appropriate places to include a few images. Thanks. -- Trevj (talk) 19:47, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

WMF response

The response has been posted at en:User_talk:Geoffbrigham#Copyrighted_screenshots_in_images. It's re-posted below:

The following is research and does not represent an official legal opinion from the Wikimedia Foundation. It may contain errors, be incomplete, or be subject to future correction. The legal department can only represent the Wikimedia Foundation on legal matters, so this is not official legal advice to the community. Please see this disclaimer for more information. Stephen LaPorte (WMF) (talk) 23:07, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

First, it is important to note that screenshots are viewed as derivative works and are protected under copyright law if the original work is protected. The United States Copyright Act of 1976 defines a derivative work as “a work based upon one or more preexisting works, such as a translation, musical arrangement, dramatization, fictionalization, motion picture version, sound recording, art reproduction, abridgment, condensation, or any other form in which a work may be recast, transformed, or adapted." (See Copyright Act of 1976, 17 U.S.C. § 101). Screenshots are analogous to photographs of a copyrighted item, and is considered a derivative work in U.S. jurisdictions.

Can I upload an image onto a Wikimedia Project if it contains a screenshot of copyrighted material?

No. Unless you obtain a proper license from the copyright holder, it is a copyright infringement. Depending on the use of the screenshot and the extent to which the copyright work is the sole subject of the screenshot, there may be a fair use defense. Whether any such use constitutes fair use can only be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. Nevertheless, Wikimedia’s policies are stricter than that of copyright law and Wikimedia Commons fair use policy does not accept fair use media files. (prepared by Lisa Gee) - Stephen LaPorte (WMF) 01:28, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

---

So we shouldn't be uploading images that have copyrighted screenshots. Any thoughts on how to continue. Should I black out the monitor screens before uploading (is it worth uploading then?), or can the images be appropriated under fair-use to relevant articles on the en-wiki?Smallman12q (talk) 17:06, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

Nothing really new. ;-) And sorry for delaying answers in the sections on top - too busy... Cheers --Saibo (Δ) 02:55, 11 February 2012 (UTC)

So how should I continue...Smallman12q (talk) 14:17, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

Well, either do not upload or upload a retouched version (blanked / strongly blurred screen). Or find someone capable of retouching to assist and upload the full images with a {{disputed|screen will be blanked very soon --~~~~}} tag and tell the other user to upload a retouched version ASAP and tell me to hide the old version's file content. Cheers --Saibo (Δ) 01:25, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

How about the Graphic Lab? -- Trevj (talk) 12:59, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

(Now notified. -- Trevj (talk) 14:12, 27 February 2012 (UTC))

I'll resume (and probably finish) uploads on the weekend of March 10th. I'll upload the computer monitor/tv monitor images with the {{Disputed}} tag.Smallman12q (talk) 00:37, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

I saw Chris Whytehead at the Beeb@30 birthday do.[3][4] Are there still some more photos waiting in the wings? -- Trevj (talk) 09:24, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

Mistakes

Possible mislabels on the site:

• http://acorn.chriswhy.co.uk/32bit_UpgradesA2G/CCS_A50004MB.html (shouldn't both be front)

  Nicely spotted! I agree - should be relabelled to match convention, e.g. File:CCS A5000 4MB RAM Upgrade (back).jpg. Thanks. -- Trevj (talk) 10:40, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

• [5] in http://acorn.chriswhy.co.uk/32bit_UpgradesH2Z/Irlam_MovingImage.html should be bottom

• last pic should say top off
• Ro,bo Productions Vidi-Archimedes -> "Rombo"

Fixes at end

At the end, I'll add galleries and fix en| -> en|1= .Smallman12q (talk) 17:10, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Screenshot censoring

Hi Chris, I spotted your message at the Graphic Lab and I've altered a few of the images listed above. Is that what you had in mind? nagualdesign (talk) 04:06, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

 Thank you. They look good to me! -- Trevj (talk) 14:22, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

If you'd like me to do some others just let me know which ones. Some of the images on that list seemed to be photographs of the screen or operating system, which would just look like several pictures of the same Panasonic TV if they were censored. And if you have any requests in future just drop by the Graphic Lab. I usually visit there at least once a day and rarely come to the Commons. nagualdesign (talk) 05:55, 5 March 2012 (UTC)