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User talk:Rodhullandemu

St James' Church, CoatbridgeEdit

Hi, I realise that St James' Church is not a plural, but the correct usage of the apostrophe in English does not require a second 's' when used after the first. The website for the church on the Diocese of Motherwell uses this variety of spelling, however I can understand this specific church having some trouble with its naming, since other websites instead use the name "St James the Greater Church", so this is really up for debate!

Thanks, JoshTilley (talk) 21:15, 14 April 2017 (UTC)

I think as long as people unambiguously know which church we are talking about, minor differences in its name are unimportant, other than spelling errors, of course. Rodhullandemu (talk) 21:18, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
(talk page stalker) There is no one correct way of spelling possessives of words ending in S. Some authorities say to omit the last S only in polysyllabic words, others say only in classical and biblical names. Some go by pronunciation: if you would say “Jamezez” aloud then include the S, otherwise don‘t. Personally I prefer to write the S in most cases, certainly including monosyllables like “James‘s“ and “Charles‘s“, but I wouldn‘t call anyone wrong for omitting it. For category names here, my preference would be to follow the organizations‘ usage, particularly as revealed in any photos showing their signage.—Odysseus1479 (talk) 23:13, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
Perfectly happy with your reasoning. For churches I add that specifically use the ending apostrophe and no 's' on their websites, I'll follow suit, but I won't dispute any of your 's' edits from now. Thanks, JoshTilley (talk) 16:48, 15 April 2017 (UTC)


I assume that you've noticed my ping about the Geograph work I'm doing at present, migrating things a long way down the tree (in locations at least). However I'm still not sure about north of the Tweed. I'm drawn to civil parishes but have doubts. They are used by Historic Environment Scotland to describe the location of listed buildings, which is mirrored by the WP lists about them. However, I don't think there is any other use. Community council areas might work better, but they seem to be very low profile too. The biggest problem there is just getting hold of the data!

One example: File:Trees on Am Bàthaich above Track - - 1333855.jpg. Its currently categorised as being in the Highlands. It is in Moy and Dalarossie CP, which I can easily detect that and use. Its also in Strathdearn community council area, but its a pain-in-the-neck to work that out.

Is there any other sort of localisation that would work? I'd prefer to use administrative features to physical geographic ones, for consistency with the rest of the UK and its less subjective (does that show part of the actual valley of Strathdearn?) That said, its logical to treat islands as distinct entities...--Nilfanion (talk) 22:26, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

@Nilfanion: I was aware that Highland was going to be difficult but hadn't thought much about it other than that Community Council areas would be good subdivisions if we could determine their boundaries. I know Fae has done this with the council areas and counties but I hadn't got as far as asking him if he could look into auto-categorising on that basis, and I'm not sure the boundaries of community council areas are coterminous with civil parishes. I think if we can use CPs for now it should be easier at some stage to gather them into CC areas. Sorry if that's not very helpful but I haven't considered it for a while. Rodhullandemu (talk) 08:36, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
There may be some similarity between CPs and CC areas, but in general they are different. One specific issue is the CPs are aligned to the historic counties, while the CC areas are to the modern council areas. However, I think that last comment is gives justification to press ahead using the CPs (when in a single council area), as its easier to sort to the CC areas in the future with some meaningful localisation already done instead of just all being lumped in the top-level cat.
The biggest drawback I see is that will lead to a parallel category structure, but its only going to be at the local level, so I don't think its too big a deal. Let me know if you have any further thoughts, it will probably be a couple weeks before I start actual work on Scotland.--Nilfanion (talk) 08:44, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
OK, my plan for this to to create categories for all 871 civil parishes, putting them all at "Category:<parish> (civil parish)". That avoids any ambiguity with namesake towns (or the community councils). However, many won't clash so can safely be moved and redirected to the plain name (eg Penninghame). The advantage of the systematic approach is its simplicity.
My chief concern now is ones like Lismore and Appin, which is split between Highland and Argyll. It would be good to split the parish in two for categorisation, but can you think of a good way to do that? "Lismore and Appin (civil parish, Highland section)" is ridiculously clunky, but would work.--Nilfanion (talk) 11:22, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
Good luck with that, I've no objection. Things that straddle boundaries are always troublesome because I think categorising by both is unhelpful because it puts files into the wrong area. What I've done for, e.g. The Pennine Way is to split it into county/council area tranches, and the naming convention I've used is "X in Y", so your example would be Lismore and Appin (civil parish) in Highland council area and Lismore and Appin (civil parish) in Argyll and Bute. The parent would be Lismore and Appin (civil parish) - but that doesn't solve the problem of any cats with the same name but in different, but not overlapping, council areas. Is Lismore And Appin any more than a CP? In which case perhaps it doesn't need the "(Civil parish)"? Just some thoughts. Cheers. Rodhullandemu (talk) 11:45, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
Yep, that matches my thinking - and like you I dislike putting cross-border things in the overarching cats, using "x in y" cats to avoid that where possible. I'll get the categories created over the weekend. The real challenge is matching the existing categories for villages to the CPs, and will probably take some time of course...--Nilfanion (talk) 12:11, 18 May 2017 (UTC)
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