User talk:Jameslwoodward

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My formal name is James L. Woodward, but I prefer to be called "Jim"


Copied from e-mailEdit

Hello Jim,

i'm novice on Wiki. I've created an article about my farther Кравченко Володимир Григорович. He is creator of medical preparation Cidipol and I added scans of his patent in Russian Federation and trade sign certificate for Cidipol. Yes, sure, they are not mine but I want to show it for others. If I broked wiki rules in some way would you say what should I do in such case. Thank you. My regards

Andriy (Avkpol)

First, except for matters that require confidentiality, communication on Wiki matters should take place here, rather than by e-mail.
As for the two documents, since you did not actually create them, in order to keep them on Commons, you must show that they are free of copyright, (a) because they are old, (b) because the creator has freely licensed them, or (c) because the law of the country where they were created make them automatically copyright free (that is, in the Public Domain). Also, you cannot license them as CC-BY-SA -- scanning a document created by someone else gives you no rights which you can license.
I don't know if Russian patents are PD or not. The first bullet at {{PD-RU-exempt}} suggests that they may be, but "may be" is not sufficient here. If the "trade sign certificate" (is that what we would call a trademark registration?) is a government issued document, it may also be PD under the same clause.
I suspect that one of our colleagues will answer the question at each of the DRs. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 19:45, 31 August 2016 (UTC)
.     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 19:45, 31 August 2016 (UTC)

[Copied from e-mail]
Hi, excuse my writing here but I didn’t find on the page https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Jameslwoodward where could I reply. Should I edit page? Anyway, you didn’t make clear the situation for me. I understand I must wait for your colleagues decision? From other side these documents belongs my father as patent/trademark owner, what the problem with it? e.g. you are not issuer of you driver license but you are owner of it. Does it mean you can not scan it and show in internet? Please say me exactly what and how should I do.Avkpol (talk) 14:33, 1 September 2016 (UTC)


In order to add comments on a Wiki talk page, you can click on "Edit", either at the top of the page or at the top of the section.
I am sure that you understand that if you buy a book, that you cannot make copies of it to sell -- that is the whole point of copyright. What is true of a book is true of any created work -- art, writing, architecture, and so forth. Owning the original (or a copy) of a created work gives you no right to make copies -- that right is almost always retained by the creator.
In your driver's license example, in most countries (and 47 USA states) the copyright to a driver's license remains with the issuer, so you do not have the right to make copies of it. That is particularly true if there is a photograph, as the photograph definitely has a copyright while the printing on a driver's license may be too simple to have one.
It is up to you to prove that these documents are not subject to copyright in Russia. As I said in my earlier reply, that proof may come from one of our colleagues who is more familiar with Russian copyright law. If that does not happen, they will probably be deleted.
For reference, these are Commons:Deletion requests/File:QScan08302016 200819.jpg and Commons:Deletion requests/File:Цидіпол товарний знак.jpg. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 11:39, 1 September 2016 (UTC)
.     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 11:39, 1 September 2016 (UTC)
Above you say "Russian Federation", but Кравченко Володимир Григорович says that he is Ukrainian. Were the documents created in Russia or in Ukraine? .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 11:46, 1 September 2016 (UTC)
Кравченко Володимир is for sure Ukrainian and lives in Ukraine. The documents were created: one in the USSR yet ( Trademark registration issue year 1987) and another one in Russian Federation(Patent, 1993). The term of patent and trademark was expired already and they have rather historical sense.
So, ok, let`s wait for your experts decision. How long it may be? Avkpol (talk) 14:33, 1 September 2016 (UTC)
DRs must stay open for a week. Usually others will comment during that time, but there is no requirement. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 13:00, 1 September 2016 (UTC)

Role accounts on English WikipediaEdit

There are two experienced English Wikipedia editors, user:FastLizard4 and user:Mlpearc, who are at the beginning of advocating for a new role account function on English Wikipedia.

The role account would be so that people with organizations and projects could get "account creator" rights to register many people for new accounts at in-person events. On English Wikipedia, there is a limit of 6 account registrations per IP address, so if people meet in one place, then one way to register a group is to have someone use this userright to register all attendees after the first 6.

I thought that you might care about this because it is another path by means of which the Wiki community is getting advocates for role accounts. I am not sure if Commons has a registration cap of 6, but if it does, then I can imagine the precedent of English Wikipedia pouring into Commons as more people organize photo walks. I live in New York, and we only occasionally have hosted photo walks in the past, but we have a big one coming up in October at en:Wikipedia:Meetup/NYC/CommonsLab and there is some talk of doing these much more often.

Since you care about policy around role accounts I thought I would let you know.

As I have said before, my preference is for clear policy. I get pressure from both sides to both use and avoid using role accounts. There are organizations which are beginning to have a financial stake in this issue, and Wiki contributors who are investing in the outcome on either side of the issue. Blue Rasberry (talk) 15:15, 2 September 2016 (UTC)

Blue Rasberry , thank you for the note. I have enough to do on Commons without getting into battles on other projects. I also have much less problem with the concept on WP:EN because the copyright issues are very different.
On Commons, I firmly believe that an account should have only one user.There are two reasons for this.
First, users come in all qualities. We have honest, careful, knowledgeable users, some who are none of those, and users in every combination of them. Having three major roles (Admin, Bureaucrat, and Checkuser), I get to know that pretty well. Since active Admins, in particular, are in short supply -- 90% of Admin work is done by fewer than 25 people -- it is important to Commons that we be able to work fast and accurately. Over time we get to know most of the active users -- who can be trusted to be honest, knowledgeable, and careful, and who cannot. If accounts have more than one user, then Admins lose that important help to their work.
Second, I don't think that a responsible and careful institution would want a Commons account that had more than one user. Since the point of institutional accounts is to allow institutions to upload and freely license some of their archive, the Commons user must be given permission to do this. In most jurisdictions, for an institution to give away its property, the governing body (Board of Directors or Trustees) must approve. Suppose an institution has ten people using one account and one of them is fired for cause? At the very least, the institution will have to change the password on the account. At worst, the fired person will have uploaded images that were not authorized and the institution must request their removal (this has actually happened). If ten people have been uploading images, how do we figure out which images are problems? Damage control is a real issue.
I see no reason why an institution cannot simply use separate accounts with similar names -- "User:National Institute of Geology User Smith" and "User:National Institute of Geology User Jones", for example. That solves both problems while maintaining the ability to know the users and keep track of their individual work. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 09:54, 3 September 2016 (UTC)
Your arguments are entirely sound. I support you in everything you are saying. I am not one who needs to be convinced.
If you wish, please change the existing policies to forbid role accounts. You have respect of other Commons users and can unilaterally delete and change policy. You already know the issue at the username policy - just delete everything that says role accounts are allowed and explicitly state that they are not allowed. If it helps, I will help identify all the policy that needs to be changed to forbid the practice, and I will list all the Commons accounts that are role accounts for institutions so that they can be blocked until the name changes.
I am behind you on this. The thing that I am not ready to do is deny that there are two sides doing two different things and ignoring that the other side exists. Until the issue is resolve, or someone wants to force things one way or the other, I am comfortable pointing out that there are two sides doing two contradictory things and that both sides refuse to have a discussion with each other to resolve the issue. Here is how I rank the current options in my own order of preference:
  1. Either side dictates that the other has to be eliminated. Either role accounts are clearly allowed or clearly forbidden.
  2. Both sides exist in direct opposition to each other, clearly contradicting each other and giving contrary guidance on what to do, and this conflict is openly acknowledged. Various users create role accounts or advise to avoid creating role accounts, and everyone acknowledges that one side or the other is doing something wrong without clarifying the issue.
  3. Both sides exist in direct opposition to each other, clearly contradicting each other and giving contrary guidance on what to do, but everyone lies and says that they see no conflict and that the rules are clear. One faction creates role accounts, the other forbids it, and both sides refuse to acknolwedge that the other side is creating Commons policy that either says to create role accounts or forbid them.
Right now I think the Commons community is somewhere between 2 and 3 on this list. I would prefer the situation to be more strongly 2, and even more prefer that some dictator force the issue to number 1. If you are ready to change policy and start blocking established role accounts then say the word and I will join in, but I wish for someone else to take the lead on this and actually be ready to block role accounts when they are identified. As soon as some established Commons contributors with sensitive relationships with organizations are pressured out of their accounts I think that could settle the issue. Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:03, 3 September 2016 (UTC)
Now could be a time to speak up and post a comment, if you wish to start a conversation. I really do not know what to do except regret that so much precedent is being set on both sides without any conversation or agreement. Blue Rasberry (talk) 21:51, 6 September 2016 (UTC)

Suzuki motorcyclesEdit

I spent a lot of time making the structure. I wanted to continue today. Clear the gallery 12 hours after its creation, it's really not cool. Can you put it back , Thanks Camulogene77 (talk) 06:36, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

 Done
It may not be cool, but we get 10,000 new pages ever day and delete 1,700 of them, so if you create a new page that is out of scope, it is inevitable that it will be deleted (single image galleries are not allowed).
In the future, either populate the gallery immediately or add the {{Under construction}} tag, as I have done in this case. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 12:48, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

Falastin newspaperEdit

How does copyright laws apply to uncopyrighted material? The book features an image of members of the newspaper and in the caption it says something around "after writing to the Jordan Press Association, it turned out that all pictures, drawings and articles published on Falastin (1911-1967) was published under public domain, including this picture." --Makeandtoss (talk) 21:00, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

With very limited exceptions, and none that might apply here, all created works have a copyright from the moment of their creation. While it is possible to put copyrighted works in the public domain with an appropriate license (for example see https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/deed.en) there is no such thing as "published under public domain". In order to restore this image, we would need to know what such license was actually used and whether it actually applied to all of the work shown on the page.
Also note that the statement you quote is very unlikely to be accurate -- there were, as I said at the UnDR, three different sets of rules in place from 1911 to 1967 and different licenses would be required for the latter two. As I also said there, work done under the Ottoman Empire is PD, and I suspect that the statement applies only to that period. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 21:43, 15 September 2016 (UTC)
What if it was published under CC0 1.0 or any 1930s equivalent? This newspaper is seriously old and I have been storming archives in Jordan trying to find what license it was published under, I managed to find a really old library with a book about Journalism in Jaffa, the newspaper's hometown. The book is in Arabic and the "published under public domain" is a rough translation of "تم نشرها تحت الملكية العامة". --Makeandtoss (talk) 07:53, 16 September 2016 (UTC)
First, since the book speaks of something that cannot be, it is suspect as a source of accurate information. Second, even if the book is roughly accurate -- that the newspaper did, in fact, explicitly put its content in the PD throughout its life under three legal regimes -- we would have to see the actual license to ensure that it is valid, irrevocable, and applies to everything in the image. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 09:39, 16 September 2016 (UTC)
I have contacts with the descendants of the newspapers' founders, potential copyrights holders of potentially copyrighted material. What kind of document are we looking for? Governmental? Company-wise? Press association? --Makeandtoss (talk) 09:54, 16 September 2016 (UTC)
Since the book that makes you think the paper is PD is not accurate, I can't tell you what sort of document it might be -- whatever supports the book's assertion that the paper was PD through three very different legal regimes.
As for the descendants of the founders, it is unlikely that they own any copyrights. It is much more likely that the copyrights belong to whoever bought the assets of the company when the newspaper closed. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 10:00, 16 September 2016 (UTC)
Since the book mentioned the Jordan Press Association, is it possible that Jordan became responsible for the copyrighted material since it was a Jordanian law that closed the newspaper (Falastinː 1917-1948 British Mandate Jaffa, 1948-1967 Jordanian occupation Jerusalem, never under Israel) ? --Makeandtoss (talk) 11:13, 16 September 2016 (UTC)
Nvm, I have located the publishing company. --Makeandtoss (talk) 14:11, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

File:Kwame Nkrumah mausoleum11.jpgEdit

Hello Jim,

I Trust you're fine. What do you think about the above file? Wikicology (talk) 10:24, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

I think it should be added to my DR of all the files in the mausoleum's category -- the wall clearly has artwork on it and it is far far from de minimis.

OTRS verificationEdit

A user has uploaded a film poster and mentioned that the mail has been sent to OTRS for proof, but the user does not seem to be associated with the film. As an administrator, can you verify this? File:HAN Official Poster.jpg Coderzombie (talk) 15:32, 20 September 2016 (UTC)

There is no recent (last five months) OTRS message with the words "HAN Official Poster". I tagged it for {{|delete}}. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 23:06, 20 September 2016 (UTC)

PeachoidEdit

Please take a look at this discussion. It's related to one you were involved in in the past., and your expertise would be appreciated. Thanks. Semper fi! FieldMarine (talk) 17:15, 20 September 2016 (UTC)

 Done Thanks, .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 23:07, 20 September 2016 (UTC)

File:San Francisco medical cannabis program ID card.jpgEdit

Hi Jim. Is there any reason this would be PD? It's an upload from a globally locked sockmaster. INeverCry 22:56, 22 September 2016 (UTC)

Yes. Works of the State of California and its subdivisions are PD, with only a few exceptions. I think {{PD-CAGov}} applies to this. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 11:51, 23 September 2016 (UTC)

Thanks Jim. I've fixed the license. INeverCry 22:25, 23 September 2016 (UTC)

Commons:Deletion requests/Files in Category:Google Art Project works in Museo Reina SofiaEdit

Hi, could you undelete all photos in the list taken before 1937? As the files are deleted, I cannot tell you which these are. -- (talk) 12:03, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

It would be before 1936, as 1936 images don't go out of Spanish copyright until next January. Since the Spanish Civil War ran from 1936, I don't think any of them are out of copyright. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 13:12, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
I've added the undelete category for 2017, on the basis that quite a few are about to have expired copyright under Commons:Copyright_rules_by_territory#Spain. Thanks -- (talk) 13:14, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
Ah, now removed without any explanation. It's the sort of rudeness I expect these days, you'd think this was a primary school playground. diff. -- (talk) 13:55, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

@Jim, could you please make as statement whether 'on the fence' means you agree or you disagree? People start interpreting to their advantage. Jcb (talk) 14:16, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

Jcb, stop creating personal argument please. I have no "advantage" to gain here. I neither uploaded these files, nor do I profit by them. My interest is correctly to preserve Commons' collections of high quality public domain images. This is not a role playing game where you must win something or defeat others. -- (talk) 14:20, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

My "on the fence" means just that -- in the absence of additional information, I think it is an even money bet. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 17:32, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

So no reason to start undeleting criticless in 2017 then. Jcb (talk) 20:13, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
The claim that the addition of the undelete category was disruptive and the subsequent use of sysop rights to indefinitely protect the deletion request were highly inappropriate. I have raised the matter for review at Commons:Administrators'_noticeboard/Blocks_and_protections#Review_of_a_protection_action. Using sysop rights to "win" personal arguments is not why they are granted by the Commons community. -- (talk) 21:39, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

Malaysian copyrightEdit

I posed these questions to another editor about a month ago but never got any response even though they have been active. Anyway, your answers to copyright questions always seen good, so I would like your opinion on this one. My concern stems from a question about their stamps. I did some research and wrote up an initial summary at Commons:Stamps/Public domain#Malaysia. I also found a working link for the copyright act which is dead on the general copyright page section but I've fixed that. I'd like your opinion on my concern with the fact that since 1992 the post office is now a corporation, so is there any real difference from the government work 50 year rule and the corporate rules, or post-1992 is the copyright period determined by the life of the author. However, I have not seen any records of the authors or engravers, like we do for France where the stamps often have the name of the engraver and designer on the stamp. This WIPO page may be of help and this does not mention corporate works.

While I'm on the subject of stamps, no one ever responded to my question on Libyan stamps now archived at: Commons:Village pump/Copyright/Archive/2016/07#Stamps of Libya. If you have input on that I'd also appreciate it. Thanks Ww2censor (talk) 08:00, 25 September 2016 (UTC)


I think your reading of Malaysia is probably correct. It's clear that government works are covered for fifty years and I think it likely that once the postal service was privatized, its works would follow the pma rule, unless the anonymous rule applies. However, I think this introduces an unnecessary question and complication into the case book. The issue is moot until 2042, since any post-1992 work must be under copyright until then no matter how the rules are applied. While we often take a very long view here, I trhink we can safely not worry about this question.
I also agree that Libyan stamps are under copyright for thirty years from first publication. .     Jim . . . . (Jameslwoodward) (talk to me) 10:31, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!Edit

The Original Barnstar
I appreciate you for your fair work on wiki common Nagric 11:41, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

Nomination of my files to deleteEdit

Please for give my rudenessNagric 12:22, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

Articles and diagrams are originalEdit

Articles and diagrams are original and self made, not copied.Each article of Wikipedia having its own educational purpose .I do not know higher label English.Dear sir I have done a mistake to create a page of "Solid geometry" that was to using of Autopetrol button.This was blunder and wanted to undone but suddenly electric discontinued due to storm.Please excuse me for this.Thanks.Nagric 05:25, 26 September 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Teacher1943 (talk • contribs) 05:25, 26 September 2016 (UTC)--Nagric 05:27, 26 September 2016 (UTC)

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